Aihe: ** LÖYDETTY? ** Gibson Les Paul Studio Lite M-III electronics 1 | |
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![]() 30.08.2017 11:12:59 | |
The quote is from the original post, 6.11.2010 : https://muusikoiden.net/keskustelu/posts.php?c=15&t=195360 when my guitar was stolen, and the update is after the '*****' unhappy: Hello, My guitar was recently stolen within the last two weeks, in the Helsinki area, 00560. It was a rare translucent blue Gibson Les Paul Studio Lite with M-III electronics - that's from their M-III series of Superstrat-like guitars. It's two humbuckers, with a single coil in the middle. The hardware is black chrome. The stats can be viewed here: http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p12/websitevelocity/wMIII_2.jpg And the few pictures I have can be viewed here: http://s1235.photobucket.com/albums … aul%20Studio%20Lite%20M-III%20Blue/ The volume and tone knobs are a custom paint job I did, quite silly: one is red with a blue lightning bolt, one is blue with some red and orange flames. The original black knobs were in the standard Les Paul case which was also stolen, so those knobs may have been put back. The pictures in that link have some further descriptions. The serial number of the guitar is: 91445523 If you have any leads, you can post here, but if you have definitely seen it and have further information, I advise you to contact the police at Pasila and speak to: M. Salo, puh. 0718774505 J. Hirvonen puh. 0718775519 Kiitos ****************************************************************** 2472 days later, as Muusikoiden.net has kindly informed me, there is an update of my stolen guitar. While randomly feeling nostalgic for it, I googled its serial number, and it popped up on Helsingin Pantti's website. Item number 427, of their auction A465, which seems to have happened 24.08.2016 (if only I had searched last year!!) http://www.helsinginhuutokauppakamari.fi/hk.php?hk=A465&offset=400 Now here's the crap part - the police report I made for a stolen item, on 11.11.2010, has expired (more than five years), and the police's response was that there's nothing they can do as the 'crime has expired'. Now, I'm not in Finland anymore, so I'm incredibly frustrated by this limitation. I've written an imploring e-mail to Helsingin Pantti, and am awaiting their response, but in the meantime, perhaps someone can help me if they know what options I have. 1) Is the police's response normal? Is there any way to reopen the case? Isn't there a difference between a theft's report having expired, and no longer being able to prosecute the person who stole the item (which I thought was the police's stance here), and the fact that a stolen item is forever a stolen item until its original owner repossesses it?! 2) I'm giving Helsingin Pantti the benefit of the doubt here, as I haven't heard from them yet (though I have a sneaking suspicion they're not going to care), but is there really no legal recourse here for me to get my stolen property back?! Would I have to hire a lawyer (I don't even know how to begin to search for one when I'm outside of Finland..) 3) Any advice? Anyone had a similar situation?! HELP! | |
![]() 30.08.2017 12:28:01 | |
First part sounds like bullshit. You can prove that the guitar is yours. I believe police is trying to be lazy again | |
![]() 30.08.2017 22:12:40 (muokattu 31.08.2017 11:06:06) | |
I'm assuming the guitar was stolen, since embezzlement would change things somewhat. So, for a stolen (there are more definitions in the legal lingo, but I'll use a common term) guitar: The crime (thus also procecution of the perpetrator) may have expired, but your property rights haven't. Since you made the police report, and can otherwise prove your claim, I am fairly sure Helsingin Pantti will decide to return the guitar. Bad publicity is something they don't need. (I wonder if muusikoiden.net could/would arrange an email campaign for you, should the need arise...) But if they don't *do the right thing*, it gets complicated. You'd need to sue whoever has that guitar when you get to that point. Living abroad doesn't help, naturally. Edit: You don't say anything about insurance & possible compensations/refunds from there. | |
![]() 31.08.2017 08:04:04 | |
Hi. As a someone who has had his (un)fair share of items stolen from him over the years, I feel for You. At least You have a slim chance of getting Your stuff back, no such luck for me :(. unhappy: Item number 427, of their auction A465, which seems to have happened 24.08.2016 (if only I had searched last year!!) http://www.helsinginhuutokauppakamari.fi/hk.php?hk=A465&offset=400 According to that auction sheet, the guitar did not sell, at least not on that auction. unhappy: 1) Is the police's response normal? Is there any way to reopen the case? Isn't there a difference between a theft's report having expired, and no longer being able to prosecute the person who stole the item (which I thought was the police's stance here), and the fact that a stolen item is forever a stolen item until its original owner repossesses it?! The response is quite normal. Finnish police is undermanned, underpaid, and up to their necks with far more pressing matters. It's the same pretty much everywhere as well, so we are no exception over here. I'd point out to them though that the time the stolen item was kept stashed away, is pretty much the same as the time needed for the "stolen" status linked to the serial number to vanish from the active records. The person who pawned it, might well lead them to a larger stash of stolen goods waiting to be sold after the theft has expired and is removed from the active lists. Now, why on earth some dimwit chose to pawn the guitar with his/her personal information permanently on record, instead of selling the guitar anonymously as is usually the way to getting rid of stolen items, that's just guesswork. That brainfart probably works on Your favour though. unhappy: 2) I'm giving Helsingin Pantti the benefit of the doubt here, as I haven't heard from them yet (though I have a sneaking suspicion they're not going to care), but is there really no legal recourse here for me to get my stolen property back?! They have to care. They have no choice. They kept and sold stolen goods, so they have commmitted a crime even though they did at least the minimum that the law requires for them to do to prevent that from happening. Even tough the list they recieved from the police before that auction didn't include that particular instrument anymore, and the search they probably did before taking the guitar in did not reveal that the guitar was stolen just about 5 years earlier, it must have been in in several previous records they have had recieved. So, someone has effed up big time. Wasn't the first time, and won't be the last either. If You can prove Your ownership to the item, theoretically You could sue them since it's been less than a year since they sold it. If they even sold it, that is. My guess is that You don't have to sue anyone though, especially if the guitar is still in their posession. They are not in the business to stash or sell stolen goods, and according to a friend of mine stolen goods are offered on daily basis to the Helsinki pawnbrokers, cash converters and flea markets, so it's in their best intrest to resolve any and all mishaps if they can. Good luck. Regards: Samuli | |
![]() 31.08.2017 08:20:29 (muokattu 31.08.2017 08:29:44) | |
Hello The police cannot press charges for thefts after 5 years that is in the Finnish law. ie. the ability to press charges for thefts gets old in five years BUT that does not mean that the guitar stay at the "new owner". That never gets old. So if you have the proof that the guitar was stolen and it is your guitar. You should get it back. Try to call the pawn shop. | |
![]() 31.08.2017 11:35:18 | |
Huutokauppa (A470) 21.09.2016 482 1 SÄHKÖKITARA GIBSON LES PAUL N:O 91445523 PINTAVIKOJA LAUKKU Lähtöhinta: 600.00 EUR Korkein tarjous: 600.00 EUR (id 2016) http://www.helsinginhuutokauppakama … i.fi/hk.php?hk=A470&kategoria=7 | |
![]() 01.09.2017 19:45:55 | |
After a few days in the dumps, and not thinking to check this thread right away as I had low hopes for my case, how pleasantly surprised I was by all the replies. Thank you, all! s8na - Yes, the police seem lazy, but I can understand that there are much more pressing matters for them, so I think, as others have suggested, persistently trying to contact Helsingin Pantti is my best bet. 73nd3r - I hope Helsingin Pantti will *do the right thing*, and I'm very interested in this idea of some kind of e-mail campaign with muusikoiden.net. This seems to be a large and good community. I was considering posting on Reddit, but wasn't sure which subreddit would be best. I'm also thinking, should I not hear from Helsingin Pantti at all (or should they flat out say they can't do anything to help), to make something like a change.org petition (though I'm not sure that would be the right 'venue' for such a matter? - are there good Finnish petition sites?) You said at the end, "Edit: You don't say anything about insurance & possibilities compensations/refunds from there." - I wasn't clear if this was a suggestion, that I shouldn't say anything about insurance or compensation, or were you asking why I didn't mention any insurance or compensation...? basisti1971 - What really bugs me, though I forgot to mention it, is that after I made the police report in November 2010, I went to five or six used music shops, and three pawn shops, including Helsingin Pantti, with copies of the police report (with the serial number clearly stated) and pictures of the guitar, asking them to be on the look-out for this stolen guitar. I remember one of the pawnshops (it was in Itakeskus, I can't remember the name now) said that the serial number would be in their 'system', so if it every showed up, the police would be alerted... but after five years the stolen status really just disappears? My understanding was that the crime - the theft - expires and the perpetrator(s) can't be prosecuted (as 73nd3r said) - not that the guitar magically becomes an un-stolen good. Regardless, I think (and really hope) you're right that Helsingin Pantti made an obvious mistake here and that they should own up... steelduck - yes, I will try to call them. Still no reply; will try to send another email, maybe a Facebook message, but come Monday I will call. 11 - Thanks - I'm not sure why this page did not show up earlier in my google search for the serial number. Wow, from $1200 (1996), to a measly 600 Euros in 2017... I know this guitar hasn't aged well, but it's quite insulting! But, of course, it's not the monetary value - this guitar has much more sentimental value for me, no one in the world can possibly love it as much as I do... And so there's an id with this listing, 'id 2016', a registered Helsingin Pantti user? I wish I could also contact this person directly - but how? Again, thanks for the replies - my faith in humanity and the good will of instrument-owners has been restored. Paljon kiitoksia! | |
![]() 01.09.2017 21:00:37 | |
unhappy: "Edit: You don't say anything about insurance & possibilities compensations/refunds from there." - I wasn't clear if this was a suggestion, that I shouldn't say anything about insurance or compensation, or were you asking why I didn't mention any insurance or compensation...? I meant that if you've already gotten the price of the stolen guitar from insurance, that complicates things. How long have you waited for an answer from H-Pantti? Seems like a phone call might speed things up. | |
![]() 02.09.2017 10:27:10 | |
Write a review to the Helsingin Pantti Facebook page stating that they do not answer emails or call when you are trying to recover a stolen guitar that they have sold. Might get a reaction from them . | |
![]() 17.09.2017 14:49:18 | |
Any progress? | |
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